They actually said they are not worried about a criminal investigation because their lives are in god's hands. They did the best they "knew how to do."
Guess noone taught them about doctors and hospitals. Very tragic and pathetic. Otherwise, that young girl would be alive today. She died for no other reason than superstition.
Tomorrow, the Freedom From Religion Foundation is going to have a show about the topic of "Prayer Deaths" with Shawn Francis Peters, author of "When Prayer Fails: Faith Healing, Children
and the Law." Their podcasts are also free. Check out their site at www.ffrf.org.
this one girls death is small change in the big picture , when it comes to killing girls for religious dogmas , islam rules the roost. muslim girls are often beaten ,stabbed or strangled to death by their own families for crimes against god such as ..
a. being raped or even suspected of being raped ,sometimes raped by their own male kin , and then being murdered by the same rapist kin for bringing dishonour on the family .btw , most muslim legal systems require a woman to have four male witnesses in order to file charges of rape , nice huh ...also a womans testimony is equal to half of a mans in court .this also applies to testimony by infidels such as all of us .if your a woman and an infidel i guess your just S>O>L ..
b. dateing a man from outside the faith or refusing to marrie a man selected by her family , being a little to flirtatious or freindly to a man who is not her husband ,haveing premarital sex with her boyfreind ....
c. dressing in a western manner , ie. no proper hajib or wearing close fitting jeans ,heels ,mascara ,a pretty dress ect .listening to westernized rock music .ect ...often the punishment for these more petty transgressions is merely gang rape . however being raped moves a young woman right into collum a. above .
d.being disobedient to her husband or father or commiting adultery or being accused of adultery which is nearly the same offense
these honour killings have happened numerous times in europe and america and go on by the thousands in muslim countries .remember there are almost two billion muslim females in the world and they cant all be good girls all the time .
in iran ,young muslim girls that are sentanced to death for capitol crimes , ie murdering a would be rapist ,are forbidden by religious doctrin to be executed if they are still virgins ...a legal problem ? ...nope. her prison gaurds will rape her first, then hang her , so as not to break any koranic taboos ...problem solved . think im making this shit up ? google up honour killings and have a read .
remember dear ladies , "when a man and a woman are alone in a room together , the third person present is satan ". so for gods sake , cover yourselves up so as not to tempt us weak willed men . an afganie chador is prolly the safest bet ,its like a big bedspread thrown over your head with a little mesh window for your eyes ...you can bet its nice and warm in those desert countries where its often 120 degrees in the shade ...alaaaahhh akbar .
It takes a villiage, huh? Hey, these people were wrong-terribly, horribly wrong and they lost their child for it. The important thing to remember is that she was THEIR CHILD, not yours or mine.
I don't want anyone telling me how to care for my children-not a church or a government or busy-body, do-gooder neighbors.
Posted by billyjoeallen on Sun, 04/27/2008 - 7:02am
I don't think "Care" is the issue but the LACK OF IT.
There has to come a point where society draws a very solid LINE.
Raise your child in whatever faith, environment, culture etc... but when you then endanger a child's life, risk an innocent child's life when they have no voice in society.
SOMEONE needs to step in and make sure that child lives long enough to have a voice later on. Death I am sure is not something they desire and they cannot understand why Mommy and Daddy, the people they depend on for protection are letting them waste away when INSULIN could have saved her. a Simple daily shot. (I am a Diabetic myself.)
There is a need for "Balance" knowing when to let the parents raise the child and then when to step in for the child's sake when the parents untterly FAIL to keep them healthy for nothing more crazy than a zelous belief that... to quote Mr. Mackey... "Um, Doctors and Drugs are bad... mmmKay? Better to be sick and let God cure the devils in you... MmmKay"
As Daniel Dennett likes to say, we are "stewards" of our children, we do not own them in the sense that slaveholders owned slaves. That being said, we have a basic set of responsibilities to our children- one of those is to ensure that they are given medicare. While butting in and telling a parent how to raise their child is obnoxious and rude sometimes, it's worth the annoyance to get the message across that not giving yoru child medical care is unacceptable.
Posted by AdamBiswanger1 on Sun, 04/27/2008 - 7:13pm
Here's the latest case on child neglect and death. A 16 year old boy suffering from sever stomach pains and shortness of breath died due to lack of medical care. Their parents instead, chose to pray over him. Earlier, his 15 year old cousin also died due to not getting medical attention. She died from bronchial pneumonia.
"I don't want anyone telling me how to care for my children-not a church or a government or busy-body, do-gooder neighbors."
You seem to be saying that no one has the right to recommend any sort of treatment for your dying child, hypathetically, but not even if the recommendation is absolutely great. You might wanna clarify if that wasn't what you meant, which I hope it wasn't.
In regards to this entire topic, there are just as many, if not more, instances where deluded religious followers kill their child/children on the basis that they think they are possessed. This nonsensical presumption deriving from the minds of some religious followers is often established because the child is homosexual, or the child is Atheist, or perhaps the child has differential beliefs, or the child listens to a brand of music that the parents find is satanic or evil, or that the child doesn't want to go to church, or a variety of idiotic reasons. Several weak-minded people are influenced by scripture to do these kind of things, but I don't have to tell any of you that. I think we can all remember the Inquisition, 30 Years War, Crusades. It isn't just Christianity either. All dogma is responsible for this, and will inevitably lead to more. Society's only hope is for future generations to be able to overcome doctrination, develop the will to learn, and get over a bunch of bronze-age fairytales that has been forced down the throats of a majority of all past generationsl.
Posted by Mattsterpiece on Thu, 09/04/2008 - 1:41am
As somebody who works in the medical field, I find this (excuse the expression) god-damned disgusting. Medicine arose to help people because Yahweh and Allah were no-shows. My co-workers and I treat diabetic emergencies several times a week, and nowhere in the protocol does it say anything about praying. I've never prayed while treating a diabetic, and guess what... none of them have died under my care yet.
As the old saying goes, two hands working will do more than a million clasped in prayer.
"I believe in Spinoza's God who reveals himself in the orderly harmony of what exists, not in a God who concerns himself with the fates and actions of human beings." - Albert Einstein
They actually said they are not worried about a criminal investigation because their lives are in god's hands. They did the best they "knew how to do."
Guess noone taught them about doctors and hospitals. Very tragic and pathetic. Otherwise, that young girl would be alive today. She died for no other reason than superstition.
I just did a podcast on that topic:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=buFAva1G8JA&feature=inbox
Yep, good commentary!
Tomorrow, the Freedom From Religion Foundation is going to have a show about the topic of "Prayer Deaths" with Shawn Francis Peters, author of "When Prayer Fails: Faith Healing, Children
and the Law." Their podcasts are also free. Check out their site at www.ffrf.org.
this one girls death is small change in the big picture , when it comes to killing girls for religious dogmas , islam rules the roost. muslim girls are often beaten ,stabbed or strangled to death by their own families for crimes against god such as ..
a. being raped or even suspected of being raped ,sometimes raped by their own male kin , and then being murdered by the same rapist kin for bringing dishonour on the family .btw , most muslim legal systems require a woman to have four male witnesses in order to file charges of rape , nice huh ...also a womans testimony is equal to half of a mans in court .this also applies to testimony by infidels such as all of us .if your a woman and an infidel i guess your just S>O>L ..
b. dateing a man from outside the faith or refusing to marrie a man selected by her family , being a little to flirtatious or freindly to a man who is not her husband ,haveing premarital sex with her boyfreind ....
c. dressing in a western manner , ie. no proper hajib or wearing close fitting jeans ,heels ,mascara ,a pretty dress ect .listening to westernized rock music .ect ...often the punishment for these more petty transgressions is merely gang rape . however being raped moves a young woman right into collum a. above .
d.being disobedient to her husband or father or commiting adultery or being accused of adultery which is nearly the same offense
these honour killings have happened numerous times in europe and america and go on by the thousands in muslim countries .remember there are almost two billion muslim females in the world and they cant all be good girls all the time .
in iran ,young muslim girls that are sentanced to death for capitol crimes , ie murdering a would be rapist ,are forbidden by religious doctrin to be executed if they are still virgins ...a legal problem ? ...nope. her prison gaurds will rape her first, then hang her , so as not to break any koranic taboos ...problem solved . think im making this shit up ? google up honour killings and have a read .
remember dear ladies , "when a man and a woman are alone in a room together , the third person present is satan ". so for gods sake , cover yourselves up so as not to tempt us weak willed men . an afganie chador is prolly the safest bet ,its like a big bedspread thrown over your head with a little mesh window for your eyes ...you can bet its nice and warm in those desert countries where its often 120 degrees in the shade ...alaaaahhh akbar .
Misogyny under the guise of religion.
It takes a villiage, huh? Hey, these people were wrong-terribly, horribly wrong and they lost their child for it. The important thing to remember is that she was THEIR CHILD, not yours or mine.
I don't want anyone telling me how to care for my children-not a church or a government or busy-body, do-gooder neighbors.
I don't think "Care" is the issue but the LACK OF IT.
There has to come a point where society draws a very solid LINE.
Raise your child in whatever faith, environment, culture etc... but when you then endanger a child's life, risk an innocent child's life when they have no voice in society.
SOMEONE needs to step in and make sure that child lives long enough to have a voice later on. Death I am sure is not something they desire and they cannot understand why Mommy and Daddy, the people they depend on for protection are letting them waste away when INSULIN could have saved her. a Simple daily shot. (I am a Diabetic myself.)
There is a need for "Balance" knowing when to let the parents raise the child and then when to step in for the child's sake when the parents untterly FAIL to keep them healthy for nothing more crazy than a zelous belief that... to quote Mr. Mackey... "Um, Doctors and Drugs are bad... mmmKay? Better to be sick and let God cure the devils in you... MmmKay"
*buzzer*
Wrong answer
fablespinner.com
As Daniel Dennett likes to say, we are "stewards" of our children, we do not own them in the sense that slaveholders owned slaves. That being said, we have a basic set of responsibilities to our children- one of those is to ensure that they are given medicare. While butting in and telling a parent how to raise their child is obnoxious and rude sometimes, it's worth the annoyance to get the message across that not giving yoru child medical care is unacceptable.
Here's the latest case on child neglect and death. A 16 year old boy suffering from sever stomach pains and shortness of breath died due to lack of medical care. Their parents instead, chose to pray over him. Earlier, his 15 year old cousin also died due to not getting medical attention. She died from bronchial pneumonia.
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2008004259_webprayer18m....
"I don't want anyone telling me how to care for my children-not a church or a government or busy-body, do-gooder neighbors."
You seem to be saying that no one has the right to recommend any sort of treatment for your dying child, hypathetically, but not even if the recommendation is absolutely great. You might wanna clarify if that wasn't what you meant, which I hope it wasn't.
In regards to this entire topic, there are just as many, if not more, instances where deluded religious followers kill their child/children on the basis that they think they are possessed. This nonsensical presumption deriving from the minds of some religious followers is often established because the child is homosexual, or the child is Atheist, or perhaps the child has differential beliefs, or the child listens to a brand of music that the parents find is satanic or evil, or that the child doesn't want to go to church, or a variety of idiotic reasons. Several weak-minded people are influenced by scripture to do these kind of things, but I don't have to tell any of you that. I think we can all remember the Inquisition, 30 Years War, Crusades. It isn't just Christianity either. All dogma is responsible for this, and will inevitably lead to more. Society's only hope is for future generations to be able to overcome doctrination, develop the will to learn, and get over a bunch of bronze-age fairytales that has been forced down the throats of a majority of all past generationsl.
As somebody who works in the medical field, I find this (excuse the expression) god-damned disgusting. Medicine arose to help people because Yahweh and Allah were no-shows. My co-workers and I treat diabetic emergencies several times a week, and nowhere in the protocol does it say anything about praying. I've never prayed while treating a diabetic, and guess what... none of them have died under my care yet.
As the old saying goes, two hands working will do more than a million clasped in prayer.
"I believe in Spinoza's God who reveals himself in the orderly harmony of what exists, not in a God who concerns himself with the fates and actions of human beings." - Albert Einstein